The 1960’s In Your Words: campus life as remembered by alumni

What do I remember? What don’t I remember? I LOVED it – they were the best days of my life. That’s why I remember it with great fondness and continue to support the University financially today.

-Julian Killingley, Law, 1970
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For many of us, our days studying at university represent some of the best days of our lives, but as the years pass and times change, it becomes ever more important to record these memories and remember what life used to be like. This is why we are starting an ‘in you words’ series of articles, in which alumni remember what life was like at University at different times. We’ll be following up with special features on other decades, so please do look out for those.

We would also like to thank the archivists at the Hull History Centre for kindly giving us permission to use some of their images from their archives in this article. Unless otherwise stated, the images come from the archive.

If you have an interest in digging deeper and finding out more about life at the University of Hull in the 1960s, you may wish to explore these further articles:
Ed Bicknell: Managing Dire Straits, The Who Live at Hull, and the Union Ents Committee
An end to gowns and flour: how 1967 changed Hull
A gallery of campus 1966-68
The Sit In of 68 – Music, Politics and Friendship at the University of Hull in 1968
Introducing Muddy Waters, Hull 1968
Key Figures on Campus: John Saville – “No one ever missed a class, we felt we were learning from a genuine authority”
“Hull is the guiding principle, the link between all of us”: Alumni reunite on campus
Memories of a Party in the Theatre Lab in 1967
It’s only rocket science – a 1960’s graduate reflects on the past

The story of the University of Hull really is the story of the people who live, work and studied here with us. If reading this article brings back great memories, remember that you can still play a part on campus today by supporting our staff, students and our wider community. If you would like to make a donation to support our work, then please click this link to find out more >>

We would love to hear your memories of the 1960s or other decades – if you would like to contribute to an article then please email alumni@hull.ac.uk and share your memories or photographs with us.


I can still remember boarding the train in Manchester to take me to Hull at the start of the first term. It all seemed a bit unreal, going out into the unknown, not knowing a single soul at Hull. What would it be like, would I cope, would I fit in? I had no idea, but I expect the experience I had in going to secondary school as the only new kid helped. Why did I think I could get a degree when I was no academic whiz kid? Our Dave was on course for a 1st and I thought if he can do it, so can I, even though the odds, and my past performance weighed heavily against me. Having missed his opportunity, my dad was probably happy to forego any loss of income from his kids. There was also the pride of sending not one, but two of their children to university. It was probably even more satisfying that my mum and dad could counter those neighbours who thought I was a total waste of space in my errant youth, not that they would use it unless severely provoked.

Fortunately, there were no tuition fees in the 60’s, and grants were available for the less well-off students, otherwise I doubt that either of us would have even contemplated University. Since Dave and I were now both at University, the parental contribution calculated for our grants was split between the two of us, effectively increasing our individual grants. As a result, I got a grant of £310pa as opposed to the maximum of £340pa. I felt the hit in my third year when Dave left undergraduate life, and the whole parental contribution of £60 was deducted from my grant. Naturally, working class parents didn’t have the cash to make good the parental contribution, nor was it expected, so I worked in all my vacations to avoid debt. Earning around £20 a week for 50 hour weeks for 20+ weeks a year, plus the student grant was sufficient to give me a reasonable lifestyle and still finish University without debt.
-Alan Smith, Joint Pure Maths and Chemistry, 1969

At Watford Grammar School, during the Autumn Term 1963, we were encouraged to complete an UCCA university choice application form. I duly had interviews and rejections from both Nottingham and Keele. A rejection without interview was issued by Reading University because, I was told at the time, they may have been insulted by being listed as a third choice. Fortunately an offer was received of a B(Maths for Science), B(Physics) and C(Chemistry) from my only remaining option, Hull, without an interview. The Professor of Pure Maths, Bill Cockcroft, told me some time later that he considered interviews a waste of valuable creative time. So if you achieved two As you qualified to do Special Maths and two Bs, Joint Mathematics. This offer was the last remaining opportunity to pursue studies at a university and one that I was determined to take.
-Bill Bailey, Mathematics, 1967

I studied law at the university from 1967-1970 and went on to be a legal practitioner and later a legal academic. During my time, the Brynmor Jones Library was completed and, as I left, the Law and Social Sciences building was under construction. Sir Brynmor Jones was V-C and Phillip Larkin was Librarian. The Lawns site was recently completed and I spent my whole three years in Nicholson Hall. The university was small and comprised, if I recall, just 4,500 students – or was it 3,500? After graduation, I didn’t revisit Hull until nearly 40 years later when I returned as an external examiner in the Law School. I had an opportunity to compare the Hull University I remembered with Loughborough University 20 years later and present day universities. There is a world of difference.
-Julian Killingley, Law, 1970

I was just reminiscing about Hull yesterday and it certainly has changed since I was there 54 years ago. I came to study Physics and stayed in Ferens in my second and third years. Ferens was some distance from Hull Uni and the purchase of an old wreck of a car was a priority in my vacation time. Each block in Hall had common washrooms for the block and a single rooms which I understand is a rarity today. Shared accommodation seemed to have begun when The Lawns were constructed. The students union (just past the library) was used for getting together and having lively discussions in small groups sometimes with a beer but more usually with coffee. The large rooms at each side of the Union building were used for weekend dances with fellow students or with “townies” if they were admitted. I’m afraid that the entertainment was too good for me coming from an all boys school and my studies suffered as a result. However, I will always have a soft spot for Hull, Cottingham and of course Thwaite, it was a wonderful experience and my career worked out very well as an electronic engineer in the USA. 
-Alan Coombes, Physics, 1966

There’s no doubt, looking back, my memories of my time at Hull are some of the happiest. The 1960’s were very good to me and I thoroughly enjoyed them. I think my generation is/was one of the luckiest; free studies in brand new settings and freedom to do as we wanted. We have also been fortunate not to have been dragged into wars unlike our parents and grandparents.
-Malcolm Finney, Mathematics, 1969

I was at Hull University from 1962-1965 studying Social Studies (actually social sciences). It started me on a journey and commitment to bring the social sciences and citizenship into the school curriculum, beginning with setting up an experimental course in the late sixties in a secondary modern school, from where I was head-hunted for the University of Leicester School of Education to train teachers in this rare but developing curriculum. I have written many books and articles on all my different activities and Hull awarded me a late-in-life doctorate in 2012 based on all of my scholarship and publications. 
Barry Dufour, Social Sciences, 1965 


Social Life

Social life was great. I was a member of the university folk club, The Round, and we had many famous names perform for us – the most frequent of whom were Ewan MacColl and Peggy Seeger.  Hamish Imlach was memorable – both for his taste for rum and black (he required sixteen to be lined up before he started singing) and his memorable parodies of folk songs. His refrain for the Jug of Punch was not “What more diversion can a man desire than to sit him down by a snug turf fire?” but “What more diversion can a man desire than to beat his wife with a rubber tyre?” Not very PC but we laughed. My own diversion was a certain Social Administration student, Patricia Bowman, whom I married a month after graduation. We’re still together more than 50 years later.
-Julian Killingley, Law, 1970

Having quit football when I arrived at Hull I had much more time on my hands than I knew what to do with. I didn’t kick a ball in the first term, nor did I have any inclination or desire to. Instead, I took up squash, which I previously thought was a fruit drink and, to my surprise, still play some 40 years on, albeit with more aches and pains afterwards. I ultimately broke into the University team where I played No.1 for the second team. Even though my unorthodox style meant I regularly beat the No.5 in the first team, he could beat players I didn’t have a hope against.  I also joined the 10-pin bowling club and managed to get into the University second team for a couple of years until I lost interest.

The rest of my free time I squandered away in the Union Bar. During the week I wasn’t a big drinker and would only get through a couple of pints a night, but come the weekend, binge drinking was the fashion and often resulted in drunkenness and bad heads the following day. During the week, Youngers Tartan at 1s10d (9p) a pint was the preferred brew, but at weekends we switched to Newcastle Brown Ale at half a crown a pint, which wasn’t only lethal but had the tendency to pile on weight. I wasn’t one of those who could drink a skin-full then wake up next day as bright as a new pin. Unfortunately, I was a slow learner and suffered many bad hangovers during my student days! In the long run, having bad hangovers is a big benefit, because the penny eventually drops and you stop drinking to excess.
-Alan Smith, Joint Pure Maths and Chemistry, 1969

Whilst at Hull I was Chairman of the ‘Economics Society’. Wee held many dances, invited many interesting speakers and arranged industrial visits: Steelworks in Middlesbrough, pressed steel, cutlery, works in Sheffield, deep calming.near Selby, Needler’s Chocolate Factory in Hull.
– Charles Alterskye, Economics, 1965

Do you recognise this image, from an archival piece donated by Fred Gray?
Do you recognise this image from an archival piece donated by Fred Gray?

Politics

I learned a lot about politics while at Hull even though I was studying Physics. Joining student politics was a real challenge for me, especially as I was the last President who was expected to continue with full-time study. Persuading the Student Council that the Student President should be on sabbatical was a real challenge, which I won by letting them know my detailed diary and asking what I should stop doing.

Worrying how the students would react to the idea, by some, to dispense with the jukebox was relieved when a student moved an amendment to the motion saying we should have two jukeboxes, left us with one and most students left the meeting happy. Be careful about how I had to let all our tough rugby team know that all away matches had to be canceled after they made public fun of an “old man with an umbrella”,  who happened to be the VC of a neighbouring university while celebrating their victory there.

Noting how successful our Librarian, Phil Larkin, was with the idea of starting meetings at 4.00 instead of the usual 2.00. It made university meetings so much more efficient as they still finished at the usual time of 5.30 – home time. Being embarrassingly manhandled out of the Student Union by the bouncers when I tried to get special visitors into the Rag dance without tickets, much to watching student’s amazement. Hull was fun and a great learning experience, one never to be forgotten.
-Maurice Barnes, Physics, 1967, President of the Student Union, 1966

During my train journey to Hull in September 1968, I was handed a leaflet about a planned student sit-in. In loco parentis was one of many issues raised by student activists. The first term was very lively with the entrance to the Registry regularly blocked by students with placards. There were some fascinating debates in the Student Union, involving large numbers taking over the refectory. It was all part of my awakening and growing understanding of myself.

Over my 3 years, there were many debates, some still unresolved today. When they wanted to stir things up, a minority group in the Conservative Association would invite Patrick Wall, the M.P. for Haltemprice, who held some rather right wing views, to address a meeting. There were immediate attempts to prevent his coming on to the campus – which Wall turned to his advantage. Freedom of speech was being denied he would argue. Some of those involved went on to have political careers – Chris Mullen and Keith Simpson from opposite sides of the House. Jack Straw, as President of the NUS was a regular visitor. There were a small number of ‘champagne socialists’, one of whom was given the soubriquet ‘I’m a socialist, but where do I park my Lotus Elan?
Brian Haigh, 1971

Hull University in the 1960s was a hotbed of student radicalism and protests against the Vietnam War – second only in the reckoning of many to the London School of Economics. The V-C was a constant target of student protest, exemplified by the scornful description “If he hadn’t been born, he would have to have been invented.” There were a number of sit-ins including one of the University’s Admin building (now called the Venn building). The Student Union was fined by the University for damage done during the occupation. Forty years later I found slight evidence of that event. As you enter Venn and ascend the staircase, there is a stone plaque with the inscription “Religion has been a rock …” During the sit-in, some wag underlined the words “has been” in paint. You can still see today where the University tried to clean that off. I pointed that out to present Law School staff who had never noticed it.
-Jullian Killingley, Law, 1970


Campus

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The campus was inhabited by a small number of eccentric postgrads – one of whom I remember stalking about with long hair, ankle-length coat and a staff. Another such eccentric, Tim Poston, became president of the Student Union. He was followed as president by that well-known alumnus, journalist, quondam Member of Parliament, script writer and author – Chris Mullin. Considering how high-profile Chris was, both as editor of the student newspaper and as president, I was surprised that he failed to mention his time at Hull at all in his autobiographical books, despite describing his school days and early career. Perhaps he prefers to draw a discreet veil over his radical days at Hull. The contrast between student radicalism then and now is remarkable. When I studied at Loughborough university, twenty years after leaving Hull, I was amazed at how quiescent the student body was – hardly a squeak to be heard from that Union and certainly no sit-ins. The same goes for the students during my 27 years at Birmingham City University.
-Julian Killingley, Law, 1970


Lecturers

I had a visiting professor of sociology in my final year, a Norwegian American called Ivar Oxaal. He was decisive in shaping my career. He was in Hull for only one year but a couple of years later he returned and spent the rest of his career at Hull. His specialty was the political sociology of the Caribbean, a subject to which he introduced me, although it was not on our curriculum.

Between Assad and Ivar I developed a great interest in the Caribbean. Ivar helped me get a fellowship to do an MA in Sociology at McMaster University in Canada and in 1968 he wrote references to help me get a Research Fellowship at the University of the West Indies. Ellie and I spent the next three years in Jamaica and I signed up to do a Hull PhD under Ivar’s supervision. In 1971 we went to live in Belize which is where I did the research for my PhD on the formation of Belize as a colonial society, a study in historical sociology. Ivar and I kept in touch the rest of his life. I’m sorry to say that Ivar died last year.
-Nigel Bolland, Psychology and Sociology, 1966

Hull Law School was then its own Faculty led by eccentric Welshman, Professor F. W. Taylor. Fred was never seen without wearing a long grey scarf and was the inspiration for a certain academic in Kingsley Amis’ novelLucky Jim. His lecturing style would not pass muster in the 21st century – he began each class by giving a handout which he then proceeded to read to us. Fred’s interests were reflected in the Law School syllabus – the like of which I have not seen elsewhere. One third of the entire LL.B. syllabus was comprised of Land Law, Equity and Trusts – we had a one-year course of pre-1925 land law, one year of post-1925 land law, one year of equity, and one year of trusts. That is double what any other university gave its students. Having no dedicated building, our lectures were held on the first floor of Venn and our seminars in tutors’ rooms in houses in Salmon Grove.
-Julian Killingley, Law, 1970

I was taught by two great academics. One was Peter Worsley (anthropology and sociology) and the other was John Saville (social history). They have both written autobiographies – that can still be purchased. I am now a Fellow of the Royal Anthropological Institute (RAI), since 2004, and my colleague professors at the RAI marvel at the fact that I was taught by the great Peter Worsley.  Social life at the university then was great and I made many friends. A memorable occasion was a coach trip to Leeds Odeon to see the Duke Ellington Band live. In the coach to get there, were student fans of jazz, Peter Worsley and the lugubrious Philip Larkin, the university librarian (and famous poet). Larkin, a miserable man, sat at the back of the coach doing The Daily Telegraph crossword. He wrote jazz reviews for the Telegraph – and loved traditional jazz. We could never work out how such an unjoyous man loved such joyous music! 

We were all very political and active, taking part with John Saville in a protest meeting about bad housing outside a slum house in Lister Street, Hull. Saville kept insisting that he did not organise this – bad for his university name! I got ill on one occasion and had to spend a week in the university/sick bay opposite the university and remember that everything stopped in order to watch the new TV show ‘That Was The Week That Was’. Another memory is the time I was reading in the library and a student came in to tell all of us that Kennedy had been assassinated. We all left the library and went over to the student union building to watch the TV coverage.
-Barry Dufour, Social Studies, 1965

On meeting Bill Cockcroft for the first time as a young undergraduate it did not take long to detect that he had a quality possessed by few other academics and one that can only be described as his own personal magnetism. This instinctive ability to care about people without any regard to background, status, class or wealth proved to be of crucial importance in his career. As we used to say in our family: he was a good mixer. With his various advancements he showed that if you can empathize with individuals you can inspire them.

As young undergraduates we became aware of his presence in and around the university and were impressed by his determination to have as much fun being there as we did. Whether it was his entertaining lectures, of which we had far too few, or observing him in the Staff Refectory engaged in animated conversation with another Oxford man, Philip Larkin the University Librarian and famous poet, or later seeing him enjoying a weekend meal with his family in the Lantern Restaurant on Whitefriargate, it was obvious he knew how to enjoy himself.

His time at Hull was punctuated with several audiences with the Vice Chancellor, Brynmor Jones, and by his own admission, not all of them were cordial. Even though born just over the border the VC was regarded as being a somewhat austere Welshman. His character was in stark contrast to Bill’s typical Gemini characteristics: outgoing, a typically enthusiastic social being and, as he had proved previously, a highly intelligent person with a cheerful disposition who always had interesting things to say.
-Bill Bailey, Mathematics, 1967

I graduated in 1969 in Pure and Applied Mathematics. I have memories of Professor Cockroft: Dr Dunning-Davies; Dr Brian Pearson; Dr Thompson; a bloke with beard and glasses who taught vectors and stuff; a great bloke who taught Fluid Mechanics (Thompson?); a really good bloke who taught in the Pure Mathematics Dpt, (Denning?). Then all goes blank. Is that really 50 years ago? Am I really this old? Wonder where they are all now; hopefully not all in the blue yonder. 
-Malcolm Finney, Mathematics, 1969


Accommodation

I lived at the Lawns for 2 years. The Lawns Centre, much reduced from the original concept, and not totally finished had opened in time for the start of term. It was supposed to provide meals for those accommodated in the halls. Returning students had grown accustomed to coping with the Baby Bellingcookers on each landing and making simple meals – although working together, we sometimes excelled ourselves. Our fare often proved superior to that in the centre, which deteriorated as students voted with their feet. The University had tried to introduce a comprehensive fee for accommodation and meals from the centre. This was at the heart of a deal of student unrest. On our landing, one of the students brewed bere once a term. The metal waste paper bins were sterilised for the mash. The Bellings again played a role and bottles were collected for the product which was carefully stored in a wardrobe. Occasionally, a bottle would explode before the ‘harvest’ was ready for consumption at an end of term party.
-Brian Haigh, 1971

First, there were the friends I made at Ferens Hall, most of whom remain among my best friends. One of the first people I met was a student of law from Belize in Central America, then still a colony called British Honduras. His name is Assad Shoman. We quickly became close friends. He came to my home and met my parents at Christmas and we hitchhiked to Switzerland in the Easter holidays. In the summer of 1964 I went to Israel and he went to Palestine, where his father was from. We had very interesting conversations when we got back together in Hull.

We had a group of friends at Ferens, including Tom Ryall, John Powers, David McKay, Steven Rogers and Alan McGowan. In the summer of 1965 Assad, David and I, along with another student from Belize, Said Musa, who was at Manchester University studying law, hitchhiked from London to Jerusalem and stayed with Assad and Said’s fathers’ families who lived north of Jerusalem, in Palestine. The entire trip was unforgettable.
-Nigel Bolland, Psychology and Sociology, 1966

Spent my first year in digs (pretty grim) out near Hull FC ground; took ages to get to the Uni’ on the buses and my bedroom was freezing cold even in Summer. Used to spend as much time in the central library in the town (which I must say was excellent) before heading back to my cold and, am convinced, damp bedroom. My mum and dad gave me an electric blanket for Christmas (do they still exist?) which, when I switched it on, caused steam to rise from the bed misting up the small window through which wind would blow even when it wasn’t windy. 

I had never liked eating breakfast but the landlady wouldn’t have any of it. I recall on a number of occasions the bacon on my plate would be swimming in one to two inches of grease. Once it really was much worse than usual; all soft fat and no lean bits; so whilst she was in the kitchen I threw it on the coal fire which resulted in an unbelievable spitting of bits of coal all over the hearth rug which cost me 50% of that term’s grant to replace. The next two years were spent in Loten Hall where I had a great time. Loved living on campus. -Malcolm Finney, Mathematics, 1969


Amazing Years

After we returned to Hull I met a visiting student from the US, called Ellen Wyland, who was on her junior year abroad. In April 1966 we got married, with all the Hull friends present, including Joan Hancock, who was Ellie’s bridesmaid, and Assad, who was my best man. We have all kept in touch and seen each other often in different places over the years. In 2013 we enjoyed celebrating the 50th anniversary of our going to Hull with a reunion in Turkey, and this was followed by another in Belize in 2018 and one in Portugal in 2019. Another Hull graduate from those years, Neil Titley, was with us.
-Nigel Bolland, Psychology and Sociology, 1966

Two of my best friends were fellow students at Hull. Our friendship has been maintained over more than 50 years. In that 50th year, we visited the University and shared many happy memories.
Brian Haigh, 1971

The three years that I studied for my Joint Degree in Psychology and Sociology at the University of Hull, 1963-66, were probably the most decisive of my life. This not only because they provided the basis for my academic career, but also because some of the people I met there have continued to be friends for my entire life.
-Nigel Bolland, Psychology and Sociology, 1966

It was a most wonderful and memorable experience. I made friends with 4 guys, one of whom has died but the three of us, now old, are still in touch.  have been back to Hull many times including to study (for a book I am writing – I am writing 7 books at present) a charity project for young people who have lost their way. It’s called CATZERO – and is an ocean-going yacht in the Hull harbour that teaches youngsters team skills, co-operation and yacht skills before they all sail up to The Orkneys. 

So my commitment to Hull University is still strong (even though I have taught for years at Loughborough University, the University of Leicester and now De Montfort University, and with a link with King’s College, Cambridge as an Associate) – and I have included a bequest to the university in my Last Will and Testament. Now that’s what I call commitment and love!
-Barry Dufour, Social Sciences, 1965

8 thoughts on “The 1960’s In Your Words: campus life as remembered by alumni

  1. Barry Dufour, 1965, mentions Peter Worsley, a lecturer who influenced me as well, although he taught me, and was my academic advisor, for only one year before he went to Manchester as Professor of Sociology. Before going to Hull I had spent a year in Thailand with VSO and that experience helped me develop my interests in anthropology and sociology. Worsley was then completing his influential book “The Third World.” I have also read his autobiography which is very good. Like Barry, I had an academic career, teaching in Jamaica and the US, and doing research on the Caribbean, until I retired.
    Nigel Bolland, 1966

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  2. Barry Dufour had a great regard for John Saville as I did- he was one of the reasons I went to Hull in 1958 -Not only a great teacher but a truly good bloke who gave a lot of his time to the Athletics team in those days; officiating at our matches with other Universities. We had quite a good team in those days competing on the athletics track- now long gone, as has the cricket ground. I last saw JS. many years ago at EP Thompson`s memorial in Todmorden Town Hall. So many memories come flooding back once one reads the recollections of others. The wild nights in Ferens with scrumpy at 2p a pint- and its consequent catastrophic effect on the enteric system accompanied by wild and witty, but non-PC songs. and the girl friends who stayed the week-ends despite all the regulations. I also occupied my time as Captain of Athletics, Sports Editor of Torchlight and Secretary of the JCR. I organised an athletics tour of German universities which was a huge social success as we rushed round Kiel, Munster, Hamburg, Cologne and others with a most charming and obliging coach driver. Our hosts always presented us with flags and ceremony whilst we I fear appeared as a rag-tag bunch. That same year 1960 -another memory from someones thoughts on Rag week- We did things in style ! The prize in our fundraising raffle was one of the new revolutionary Mini cars. My friend on the Rag committee, Derek Gibbons [we`re still in touch] insisted on driving it round Hull to advertise the events. He had no licence, but this didn`t deter him from leading the Rag Parade, in front of the Mayor and Chief Constable. As I had a licence, when the raffle winner was announced we drove up to deliver the car to Eastwood Notts.[DHL would have been astonished] There were no cars in the village, the mining family had no licence- they looked on us as landing from space and people came to stare at us. After a cup of tea we left them to deal with the situation as we had to hitch-hike back to Derek`s house in Dagenham with some urgency –We were meeting the team early next morning for the German trip and I had the tickets etc ! By 9pm in the gloom we had failed many times to get a car to stop– eventually one did and he informed us the reason for folk avoiding us. We had been standing outside Rampton high security mental institution. I could go on but I sense your eyes are glazing. Happy days !

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  3. I was there 1962-65 doing chemistry. 6 women out of a total of 72! 2 years in Cleminson Hall. We used to bike into the uni, buying a second hand cycle at the beginning of term and then selling it back at the end. Money was short, even though I went through on a full grant because my parents were divorced, so I did lots of vac jobs. I then branched out into a flat near the coke/gas depot. I shared with Lesley Penn, also doing chemistry, who unfortunately died a couple of years ago. We were weaned on Newcastle Brown. We hardly ever went into town but did queue up all night for tickets to see the Beatles. I can’t say I used my degree much because at that time the labour market was dominated by heavy industry and no place for a woman. I taught a bit then went to Italy to teach EFL. since then I have lived in quite a few countries but am happily settled – or was until Brexit – in a small village just outside Trieste. My three years at Hull were wonderful, we all used to congregate in the tv room to watch The latest pop singer, Tom Jones, belt out ‘it’s not unusual to be loved by you’. But we also had to work hard and I remember the one time I failed an exam – synthesis – I had to don my gown and go and see the head of department. Happy days.

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    1. Hi Suzanne, it was interesting to read your views on your time in Hull. Very sad to hear about Lesley – I think that I met her at a reunion for Chemistry in 2007??

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